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Poster: Purple Gel Date: Sep 7, 2007 2:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

It is funny to me how quickly Heads are to blame Rhino for acting like what they are, a CORPORATION. The true blame for the state of the archive lies with GDM. One reason that the library was sold to Rhino was that GDM, horribly mismanaged the library to begin with. There just aren't enough of us true fans,or heads, who will buy anything and everything the band releases. It is just simply bad business to oversaturate the market, which is what happened.

How many truly deadicated fans are there? I would venture to guess that there never were more than 50 thousand at any given time, and most of those don't neccerssarily want every killer version of every show.

Remember, all those sold out shows included thousands who went to every show in a given tour, and many more who went to 3 or more. It was real easy to believe that there were millions of us out there, which I think is a trap that the band fell into as well, leading them to think that it was economically reasonable to release a constant stream of music. I think that the big marketing mistake since Jerry's death has been the oversaturation of available music. The average Grateful Dead fan, does not want or need that 15th (or even 3rd) killer version of Scarlet>Fire, or Dark Star etc. The fact is that in the 12 years since Jerry's death, there have been around 50 cd/dvd/collection releases. This for a band that had a cult following, which means that in no way were they in the conciousness of the mainstream. Artists like the Beatles and Elvis, who's fans number in the tens, if not hundreds of MILLIONS, did not release near as many cd/dvds in a comparable time period.There are simply not enough of us (those who would purchase everything they put out) to make it economically feasible to release so much music. While constant releases have been welcomed with open arms by us few, who else is going to purchase them. The mainstream/casual fan already has access to more Live Dead than they would ever want or need. This band, which existed on the fringes of music society, has more music out than any one else!!

Like it or not, Rhino owns the archive because the band mismanaged it, and it is very possible that they overpaid for it and will have a hard time recouping their investment.Rhino is a corporate entity who's primary obligation is to the bottom line and the shareholders, not to us Deadheads, and the band knew this when they signed the rights over to them. My guess is that, even though we would all like to see a steady stream of releases, Rhino's bottom line will be better served by letting the music out in small increments.

This post was modified by Purple Gel on 2007-09-07 21:36:53

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Sep 7, 2007 2:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

and what he (Purple Gel) said...

Also, am I the only one who thinks rhino does a great job with other artists and re-releases? Because I do (just ask the estate of gram parsons - still waiting for amoeba and the grateful dead/gram release)

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:15pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

No way Bluedevil! I am 100% with you. Rhino has ALWAYS put put great stuff AND at very good prices too.

Personally I think some people would still bitch if they were putting out a release a day for $1.00

And what about the Dead themselves? Not exactly rapidly putting out a lot of things now were they?

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:15pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

No way Bluedevil! I am 100% with you. Rhino has ALWAYS put put great stuff AND at very good prices too.

Personally I think some people would still bitch if they were putting out a release a day for $1.00

And what about the Dead themselves? Not exactly rapidly putting out a lot of things now were they?

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Poster: high flow Date: Sep 7, 2007 2:29pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

"maybe they don't see how much money they are losing by not releasing this music to us on a regular basis."

Well, I question the value of these releases. Perhaps the cost of marketing, packaging and the man-hours necessary to release this stuff creates a situation in which it is not profitable to do so? Is that possible? I think it's a distinct possibility.

Last DP I bought was #14.

I seem to be able to get my hands on all the music I'll need for a lifetime.

So, let's take a quick poll....

How many of you would pay $15 for a 3-set release via download??

Possible answers are....

Yes
No
Maybe

Keep in mind, the maybes are killers when it comes to crunching numbers in anticipation of a marketing campaign. So, if you are thinking maybe, just pretend your finger is on the dl button and you must make a choice.

My answer is no.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:23pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

Yes, I have purchased 2DPs, one DL series and the Vault box in the last 2 months. I think that boycotting Rhino will only assure that less and less is released.

I posted about this some time ago, that just having access to the music here has actually resulted in me buying more stuff. That is why I actually think the more heinous crime is that things are constantly getting pulled from here so we can no longer even stream the stuff. Moreover when they pulled the shows for streaming they pulled the reviews so even if Rhino releases one of the pulled shows you can't go back and see what folks like Dr. Flashback had to say about it. So much for being an archive of information.

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Poster: waynecs Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

not $15 for a DL - no way,sorry.

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Poster: high flow Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

So, as I see it....

...we are all in the "HEAVY CONSUMER" demographic....ages 32-55. We have the $$ and time to follow our passion.

Yet, only about 50% of us would be willing to pay $5/set for a DL release.

Are there bigger fans of GD than us?? Where??

I must say that before I found LMA, GD had fallen off my radar somewhat. I was spending my extra $$ on camping trips and bluegrass festivals and other vacations. None of that has changed, except that I listen to as much GD now as I did back in the touring days.

They have my ears, but my cash is spoken for.:(

This is no boycott...it's my reality....Rhino's too.

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Poster: waynecs Date: Sep 7, 2007 4:06pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

Let me be clear - I wouldn't pay that kinda cash for DLs.
I have and will continue to pay for HDCDs of shows I want and like someone else pointed out it is because of the archive that I got interested enough to start buying archival releases to begin with.

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Poster: Lou Davenport Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

If it's HDCD, then very much yes, and I think I did buy 8 or 9 of the 13 dl releases before the Rhino captivity.

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Poster: huntr Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:58pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

I would buy official Flacs for shows I was at .. or better yet pressed CDs.. In a heartbeat..

as long as they were whole shows with nothing edited out or mixed away .. like say a phil bass solo

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Sep 7, 2007 3:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

my answer is also no. I hate to say it but I've been extremely spoiled when it comes to getting stuff for free. Even if they pulled the plug on torrents, etc. I STILL have more than enough to trade. And even if I couldn't find a trade, so what? That would just give me an excuse to give things I already have a more serious listen.

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Sep 7, 2007 2:48pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: RHINO RECORDS SCUMBAGS/

no